EPISODE 3: Planning To Build a New House or Rebuild Your Home? How Do You Know What It Will Cost?

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How do you begin to determine a budget for building your new home? We ask general contractors McMaster + Hill for advice on what a homeowner should know when starting the budget process, how a general contractor comes up with the budget, what happens when something is not included in the budget, covered by your insurance, and more.

McMaster + Hill Construction started as a water & fire restoration contractor in 2017. Don McMaster & Jonathan Hill have now grown McMaster + Hill Construction into a full fledged company specializing in high end remodels, home additions, kitchen & bath remodels and complete fire rebuilds. With over 40 years of combined experience, Don and Jon have the skill set to fit any client’s needs. You can see their work at www.mcmasterhill.com.

Transcript

Episode 3 Transcription

Announcer:

Welcome to From Disaster to Dream Home, the podcast that takes you inside the home-building and rebuilding process.

When interior designer Jana Rosenblatt had an 80-foot tree fall on her house, she saw the opportunity to create the customized home of her dreams. From Disaster to Dream Home provides you with the information and resources Jana wishes she had during her rebuilding process.

Now, she’s sharing with you the expertise of leading architects and home builders and the newest products and materials on the market.

Here’s your host, Jana Rosenblatt.

Jana: I can’t thank you two enough for coming back for another episode  of From Disaster To Dream Home! Today we will talk about the important topic of creating the budget to build or rebuild a new home from the ground up.

For the last 12 months, you know that we’ve been working on two homes devastated by the Woolsey fires in Southern California. And with those in mind, I want to ask a bunch of questions about how you figure out what it all costs and what we’re going to do with that money.

So let’s start at the beginning. What are the steps leading up to the beginning of the budgeting process?

Don: So I think for the first thing, we need to have a good idea of what you previously had. What kind of house did you have? What do you know?

We will be looking at your neighborhood, the things you might have had in the house, and the things you need. And then go to what you want in the house.

To  start, are we putting back a house with the same square footage, or are you adding to square footage? We want to start with the square footage and the quality of materials that you had in it. We have a pretty good idea; depending on your neighborhood, if it’s a tract house or a custom house, it’s a little bit different.

For a tract house or a house where there are 60 models, and there might be three or four other people in your neighborhood that have the same floor plan, we have a pretty good idea of what that might cost. If someone says, “Hey, we have a similar looking place, ” we can say, “Okay, here’s a ballpark for that.”

And then we go to the other things. Do you want to add square footage? Do you want it to be a lot fancier than what you had? Are you trying just to get it back, similar to what you had? And then, we can come up with a number from there.

Jana: Now, we talked on a previous show about the insurance process and about the money and the coverages. If people have some questions about that, they should go back and listen to episode two, but the question is, if someone wants to do something more than or very different than what they had, how does that work? How do you work with  the difference between what the insurance company will give them and does the insurance company care what you do?

John: No. So basically, to get a detailed budget for a house, we need a set of working plans. You would need the architect to draw on plans with structural engineering because what they had and what they’re going to put back, are likely going to be completely different.

It doesn’t really matter to us what they had before. We’re pricing what they’re building now. So, we don’t necessarily use the money the insurance has paid to budget the new house that they’re going off of because it could be less or more depending on what they want. I would say working plans to get a detailed budget would be the most important first step.

Don: If you have a house that’s destroyed, and I say, okay, you had a Honda car, and then you come to me, and you say, “I want the Mercedes,” and your reference to the insurance company was, if you have the Honda car, they’re only going to repay you for the Honda house. You don’t get the upgrade just because you like it, and you tell the insurance company, “I like more,” they’re going to pay you what we call like for like.

So whatever you have, that’s what they owe you back. They don’t owe you for your dreams or anything else; they only owe you for what you had. So anything beyond that, square footage, fancier things, then we have to figure out, okay, what’s that going to cost you?

We try to get a feel from the homeowner; what are you actually looking for? We could then give them a ballpark. So we start with that ballpark figure and go from there.

Jana: So if you hadn’t planned on your house burning down and you didn’t sock away an extra $500,000 to, add to your allowance for your dream house, how do you help the client stay on track? Do they honestly say to you, “Listen, I got to work within the budget that I’m being given,” or how do you help them understand the process?

Don:  I think that’s part of what Jon said,  we need to  get a set of plans to work from. And the finishes that are inside are usually where the cost is.

If  you stay with a similar square footage house; you’re probably going to be fine with the money that you get from your insurance company.

What goes beyond that? Let’s say you had carpet, and now you want $30 a square foot wood floors in your house. You have the same square footage, but there’s your first  bump. And you could tell the people, “Look, they’re going to pay you for carpet. So that line item that you had carpet, if you want to pay more, that’s great, but here’s what you had.”

You try to really direct them to what they had. And if they want to pay more, then you say that that’s fine and give them an idea of what to expect. But yeah, sometimes it’s hard to reign everybody in and keep them to make sure that you get the job done. Hey, we’re trying to work with you to get your job done for the amount of money that you have.

Jana: Yeah. When you say hard to reign everybody in, I’m guessing the interior designers is part of that everybody.

Don: Oh yeah, they’re right up there at the very top.

Jana: I know. Hey, some of us really care what the budget bottom line is, even if it doesn’t appear to be the case through the process.

Don: But that is part of the design. The designer also has to know, okay, this is the budget that the people have. And if they want to spend extra money, I think all of us in the construction part would say, “Hey, yeah, we’re more than happy to have you spend more money.”

Jana: Yeah, right, and make it more beautiful.

Don: “We’re happy to do it for you.”

Jana: So in my experience, building 20+ houses from the ground up, I rarely get to meet the architects of the homes I worked on. I’m usually called in at the end of the architect’s  process.

How does the architect involved in the creation of the budget? Do they help educate the clients about prospective costs throughout the design process?

John: I would say yes, they do. Now, every architect’s different, but most architects should have a general idea and let the customer know if he’s going above and beyond what his budget is, a two-story, three-story house or the size or the ceiling heights or the fancy bathrooms.

So I think it’s a good idea to let the architect know what your budget is. He can help reel  you in. For example, you may want really expensive windows, and he may be able to tell you, “Hey, look, those windows are going to add 100,000. Why don’t we use these windows?”

And so it’s always nice to at least tell the architect what his budget is. And for the most part, I think that they do work with the homeowner to educate them on that.

Jana: And do you find that the architects that you’ve worked with, and, specifically on  these  two recent homes, are current on their assessment of what certain choices will cost? Are they current on pricing?

John: I would say that the architects we work with have a pretty good concept of what things cost. It may not be the exact number, but they’re in the ballpark for the customer to make an educated decision on.

Jana: That’s good. Are you the builder consulted about what things cost during the architect’s design process? Do you see roughs and then look at them together and then move on?

Don: Yeah, one of the things that they do right off the bat is usually do a floor plan for the homeowner to look at before they start getting into the rest of the elevations and all that kind of stuff.

So they start with a simple floor plan. They show that to the homeowner before they do the walls or elevations.

We generally look at the plans together  at the beginning, and then we can start asking the questions of the architect, where is this going from here? Or how come he’s got a game room that’s 2,000 square feet? Those kinds of things.

If we see something that looks out of line, we’ll say, “Hey, that’s going to cost him a lot of money to do that,” it starts with just doing the basic floor plan to get the rooms and the kitchen and all that kind of stuff designed out.

Jana: So you do get to take a look at it pretty early in the process before they’ve committed to things that are going to be particularly pricey if you can spot them.

Once you’ve started totaling the budget columns, does that incur changes that you have to go back to the architect and say, “Okay, now, we’re really looking at this and it’s taken us over the total  that they can handle. What do we do?” Do you go back and forth a lot?

John: I wouldn’t say we go back and forth a lot. I would say it’s more the finishes that the customer does, the cabinets, the tile they choose, the light fixtures, and the plumbing fixtures. As far as the house floor plan and kind of structural design, there’s not a lot of back and forth.

There are a lot of other places to save money and not change the design of the house, but maybe the finishes, that’s where a lot of decisions can affect the overall costs.  Items like the windows or do you want stone on the side of your house or a stucco, siding versus stucco? Those are areas you can save.

 I would say it’s more in the design aspect than it is the structural part that the architect’s drawings.

Don: Along with that, some of the things that they do, like I talked about right at the beginning, when you have a floor plan and let’s say he shows that he’s going to put in 50 windows in a house. He’s calling out, “Well, I think I should have these big giant sliding doors and all this other kind of stuff,” you can go, “Hey, wait a minute, this guy, he’s not really budgeted for that,” you might need to cut back on that.

Right off the bat, we can spot some of that stuff, or if the house they had before had eight-foot ceilings and the guy now wants 12-foot ceilings, you’re going to go, “Wait a minute, the square footage is the same, but do you know the guy’s now going to pay double because of what you just did? Even though the floor plan is the same, the ceiling height is different.”

So those are the kind of things we might try to nip in the bud at the beginning.

Jana: Yeah. You need to ask those questions because when you’re looking at a plan, it doesn’t show the height of the walls, then all of a sudden, it comes back to you in the next stage. And how the walls that were originally eight, or nine feet are now 12 feet, and vaulted, as we have witnessed very recently. Of course, that affects the size of the windows, it affects all the building materials, it affects the design proportions inside and out.

So, you are going to start asking those questions even when you’re first looking at the plan to keep things on track, or does that sometimes catch you by surprise?

John: Once we’re able to see the elevations with ceiling heights, we’ll go to the architect and customer and let them know, give them a ballpark, “Hey, this is bumping up the price X amount of dollars. The ceilings are 12 feet high instead of eight or 10. Is that something that you’re okay with or is that going to be an issue? Let’s find some medium ground where you’re not killing your budget, but your ceilings are getting higher.”

So we’ll address that at the beginning because once the plans get submitted, to the county or city for Building & Safety. That’s what you’ll end up building. So you want to have those talks before the architect submits the plans to Building & Safety and Planning.

Jana: Got it. Yeah. So there is some back and forth with the architect so that there’s more than just the client looking at the details; someone more educated about it, with more experience watching out for them?

John: Yeah, the contractor will sit down with the homeowner and the architect and review the whole plan so everyone understands. We may be able to communicate something to the homeowner a little differently than the architect.

And basically, the goal of those meetings is everyone understands the house, right? Not everyone’s used to looking at elevation drawings or floor plans so it could look very confusing. And it’s our goal to help them understand what that is and answer any questions so they have a true understanding of what it is that we’re pricing out and what the home will look like.

Don: Yeah, but we like to be in on that process early.

Because we do get jobs where people just hand us a rolled-up set of plants and go, “Here you go, give us a bid,” and we start looking at it, and we go, “They could have saved money here or there,” and maybe they don’t want to. Maybe that’s exactly what they want, but a lot of people want to know, “Well, how could I save some money and still get the best bang for my buck?”

So yeah, it’s always good to be early and get some feedback in.

Jana:  Yeah. I imagine it’s much easier if you’ve been part of the thinking process to avoid missing things the client might not understand. I mean, they may not understand that  the plan and  elevation details  are not actually what they bargained for. 

Don: Correct.

Jana: How long does it take to create that first full budget for the new house, and what did it take to get to that point? When do you know you’re ready to do the numbers?

John: Well, suppose we have a final set of working plans that are being sent to Building & Safety or Planning. At that time we take a look because we know a lot of the time, the corrections are going to be pretty minimal, but we sit down. I’d say it probably takes anywhere from three to four weeks for us to dissect the plan, come up with costs, and try to break out every expense possible. So our bid is very transparent to the customer on what it includes, what it doesn’t include, what are your allowances for materials, etcetera.

I’d say three to four weeks, If we could do it sooner than that, we would sure like to.

Jana: So by the time it’s in the permitting process, you’ve already, you’ve probably gone through it enough so that you don’t expect major budget-related changes.

John: Exactly. Most of the changes are going to be pretty minimal financially. It may be the architect adding a note here or there, but typically, it’s not going to add money to the budget. If so, it’s going to be very minimal. It’s not going to change the homeowner’s decision to build that house or not.

Jana: So you mentioned the word a moment ago; ALLOWANCES,  a word is a big part of my job. The part of the budget that I, as the interior designer, first sees on a new home build is called the allowances. Can you explain to us what that is and why?

John: Okay. An allowance is, basically, a material, right? So as we’re bidding on the project, the customer, the architect, the designer, they haven’t picked out kitchen sinks, faucets, countertops, tile, flooring, right? So we can’t put an exact number on all those items because all those things haven’t been thought out yet.

We’re trying to figure out the floor plan, the windows, the ceiling heights, and maybe where recess lighting goes, but the actual material finishes are what the allowances are. So it’s a budget line item that is included in the bid.

If you spend $500 for a kitchen sink, that’s included. If you spend $3,000, you have to pay the difference. So it helps the customers stay on budget if they follow the allowances. If they want to get something higher, they understand right off the bat that that’s going to cost more money.

Don: And we usually have a pretty good idea of what the people are trying to build.

So let’s say you’re doing a standard house with a $300 toilet. So we’d say, “Hey, there’s an allowance.” We’ll put that in there for $300, a sink for $100, and maybe a faucet for $250. And yeah, if someone wants to buy a $500 faucet, that’s great, or one of those fancy new toilets for $5,000, okay, but the client will pay the difference after deducting the allowance..

And so they know, “Can I build a decent house for this amount?” Yes, you could. We’re not trying to short them, giving them a reasonable middle-of-the-road price for something that they could actually build. And if they want to spend extra money on stuff like that, they can do that.

Jana: So what happens, when I first get on a project like this, and certainly for the last two houses that we worked on, the allowances budget is both my friend and my enemy, but not my frenemy because be asking the clients now, like the architect did at the beginning, “Again, what are your hopes and dreams? Bring me pictures,” I may find what they have in their imaginations is not actually within what the allowances will afford them.

 I’m building on something that’s already been set as a budget, I really work hard to inform clients when what they want and what they’re showing me is not congruent with the projected pricing; because there are always choices you can make. And then I work really hard to see what I can do. 

Is there a template or a formula that you use in creating the allowance budget? And where does that information come from?

John: Well, that information comes from the projects we’ve done in the past, so just experience, and you could technically throw any number at any allowance. Still, we basically take previous projects and find out what the average is spent on a pendant light, a ceiling fan, a doorknob, kitchen faucet…

We use averages from our previous work, or if we have a customer that lets us know upfront, “Hey, I’m going to do built-in appliances, Wolf appliances,” then we can budget those accordingly. We can say, “Okay, let’s talk to an appliance company and say, ‘and get an idea of what Wolf appliances will cost’”

So that way, we’re more in the ballpark, but that’s not everybody. Those are expensive. And so we stay with the averages in this area on the homes we work on, and the whole idea is to eliminate any gray area.

It’s black and white. You understand what’s included in the budget for each item. So everybody knows, and it’s not just, “Hey, you get a kitchen sink, you can’t just go pick a $5,000 sink per se.” So it makes it clear for the homeowner and the contractor, and the designer to know where the materials should be allocated.

Jana: When I come aboard on a project it is most often after the plans are approved, and there’s an established  budget. Do you feel that it would be useful for the client to have an interior designer consulting earlier in the process so that they can feed out from the client or get an idea for whether they want man-made quartz or really expensive imported marble and what the looks are actually going to be that they’re going for?

John: Absolutely. It’d be a dream for all of us contractors to have a designer and have those meetings already with her and know what the materials will be because it will lead to a much more accurate budget upfront.

If you’ve had the time and meetings sitting with them and understanding what the finishes are going to be, we can just plug that into the budget and keep it simpler, keeps the change orders, and additional costs from coming up. It would be very helpful. I would highly encourage that.

Don: Yeah. And the other thing it would do is save on the amount of time that it takes to build the house because a lot of these things you have to order. So if I knew, let’s say, they wanted this super duper countertop that’s going to take three months to get as opposed to the one I can go pick up at the store next week, we’d have wanted to know that three months ago because otherwise, now, you’re just sitting there.

We’re currently dealing with a house where we’re doing the windows, and I told the customer almost six months ago, “You need to get these windows finalized,” and now, we’re about to start his house. I’m like, “You got two days and now, it’s going to be, we’ll just be sitting there looking at you, and we’ll all go home because you don’t have any windows.”

Because windows might take two to three months at this point to get, so a lot of the material, if someone can’t make up their mind and then they say, “Oh, I want something and we’re going to import it from Italy and it’ll be here in three months,” well, your bathroom isn’t going to be built for three months. So we’ll all go home and wait for it to come in.

So yeah, absolutely. The more things that you can decide what you want, the quicker your house gets built and the more timely it gets built.

Jana: Yeah. Well, I’d be more than happy to come aboard earlier, so keep me posted. But it’s tricky because I always feel like I’m the new guy on the job, and you guys are a third of the way done, and I’m constantly running to keep up.

John: Yeah, it puts a lot of pressure on the designer to really catch up. So, I would say the sooner, the better to make a designer decision.

Don:  And we always go, “Yeah, we need that answer yesterday.”

 We’re actually working on one today; the plans are sitting right here. I’ve been going over them today, there’s a drop-dead date, and if we just don’t get these things here, we’re not going to be able to continue with the house.

And even though that part is two to three months away, we know that these windows that he wants for this house are going to take that long to get.

Jana: So let’s say I got a million dollars, but really, it’s fine with me to spend another $500,000, and as opposed to somebody that’s been saving for a long time or waiting for it, they probably have a pretty good idea of what they want to spend.

I would say it’s more of an emotional thing because you’re not saving up to do that. It’s sudden and accidental. You weren’t planning on this. It hasn’t been your dream. You’ve probably been living in your house perfectly fine.

Don: And then when you have something really bad, like a fire or flood or whatever, it could be an earthquake, I mean, we haven’t had an earthquake. I remember the earthquakes. That’s probably another segment. The earthquake in ’94, what happened to all those houses then, and how everyone was affected by it.

So yeah, it’s probably a mental thing, just coming to the grips of what’s happened to you.

Jana:

So when I start a renovation budget on a project–because usually, on a renovation, I’m at the beginning of the process–I suggest the client add 10% to the budget to be prepared for things that come up. And in general, that’s covered all kinds of surprises.

Do you suggest any kind of percentage amount to prepare for possible increases in material costs and upgrades of things that they may want because they haven’t actually chosen the materials until you started building?

John: That’s exactly it. We tell people 10%. We wouldn’t be surprised if you go 10%, whether that’s change orders; there are a lot of things it could cover. Material cost increase, things like that. But 10% of the budget is a good number that you’d plan on spending above and beyond.

Jana: Yeah, that’s good to hear.

So you just segued beautifully again into my next question, which is probably the most hated term in the rebuilding process for the client, is the change order. And you don’t like them either.

John: Right.

Jana: Can you explain what a change order is?

John: Well, a change order is basically any additional cost that’s not included in the original budget. It could be hundreds of things.

An example would be if the plan calls for eight recessed lights in the kitchen, and you want to put in 25, right? So a change order would be the additional 13 lights that you’re putting in, or there are a lot of things that could be included, but it’s anything that’s not on the plan that’s thought of as you’re building the house that you want to add and they’re very popular in new construction homes. People are always changing their minds or adding things that aren’t in the budget.

Jana: Popular, but still misunderstood.

Don: Yeah. So a lot of people, as you go through the process, they’ve never really paid attention before to what a house is. And a really easy example is this wood flooring. They said, “Okay, we wanted wood flooring,” so there’s $12 wood flooring. And now, it’s like when you buy the new car or use the car analogy, pretty soon, everybody, which you thought you got the only car like that, now you find out, everybody in southern California has your car. What happened there? And it’s like that with the wood floor.

So you pick out a wood floor for $12, and now you’re walking into all your friends’ houses. They have wood floors, too. And Joe down the street, he’s got a really fancy wood floor. I think I want Joe’s wood floor, and now, he’s got $25 wood floors, so I want that upgraded.

So now, it’s a change order because I want Joe’s wood floor, and you’ll pay the difference.

Jana: And in all fairness, occasionally, as we have found, especially with newly built houses there might be things you decide not to do that are in the plans, you can trade, there’s a little trade-off in. You can choose to simplify, and you can  actually get a credit to apply to something you decide you really want. The budget can come back to you, and you can redistribute it some other way.

Can you explain how that works?

John: Yeah. Well, we work with the designer and the customer, right? Because it’s dollars and cents, so it’s a financial decision.

So, “Hey, I would like X, Y, and Z, what would that cost?” And so we give them the cost, and they can make a financial decision on, “Is that something I really want? Is that worth the money?”

Or we might have an idea of, “Hey, you can get X, Y, and Z, but we’ll take A and B off. Is that something that works? You’re not spending extra money.”

So we try to help whether they’re not spending extra money if possible, but we work with the customer, the homeowner, and the designer to try to figure out the most cost-effective way to get what they want, but yeah, not break the bank.

Don: Yeah, I’m working with a client right now who has a small place, but they have the architect drew this elaborate cabinet design for cabinets up the wall and a window seat down below in not a very expensive place.

And I said, “So do you want me to bid this because I think this costs you about $15,000?” And I said, and they were like, “Wow, that costs a lot of money.” I said, “Look, I don’t have to do this right now. You could do this in two years. When you have the room built, you could come back and revisit that if you want to put that in.”

And so that’s something that we took off it to knock off the $15,000 on their budget, that saves them money. I said, “Look, you can live in this space, work in this space, and if you decide down the road, really, I need to have that back, then you could add that back when you feel more comfortable.” 

Jana:  Yes,  that kind of adjustment can be really helpful.

Don: You can’t say, “Well, I want to have a sink over there”, “Oh, we’ll add it later because oh, there’s no drain now and now, it’s going to cost double.”

Jana: Right. Yeah, that would not be easily do-able. But you can identify some areas where people can nip and tuck a little bit.

Don: Right.

Jana: So in an earlier episode of the show, you shared that one of the most important suggestions that you’d make for people starting out this process is to be realistic about their budgets, but clearly, most of us have no idea what it costs to build a new home from the ground up. Can you help your clients? How do you help your clients keep track of their budget goals?

Don:  Well, I think basically like we talked a little bit about having the budget and having line items and say, “Here’s what we have to work with”

Go back to that word allowances, and that really is the only way to keep it in line and say, “Here’s what you can get for this, that, or the other.”

Sometimes in some of the insurance jobs, there’s an allowance, let’s say, for window blinds. What kind of blinds did you have? Did you have shutters? Do you have a basic window? Can you or would you be willing to do something more simple?

The insurance company might have given you a whole lot of money, and you could do it for half with somebody else or a different style, and you can save some money.

So you can go back to those line items and say, “Maybe we can trade this money around for something else,” like I think you mentioned earlier, you trade that back. Do you have to have the most elaborate window covering in the kids’ bedroom? Yeah, maybe not. So you trade that stuff back and forth.

Jana:  So in a world where clients are watching HDTV and design-build shows that don’t give us any accurate budget information and make things look like they’re both free and magic, how can we best take our clients from fantasy to reality?

John: Well, I would start with if it looks expensive, it’s probably expensive, and just sticking to the original plans is always going to save the customer money because the contractors reviewed the plans, they met with the designer, the architect, they have a real understanding of what it is they’re building.Its when the customer wants to start changing things it is always going to increase costs because there’s more work to be done by every trade, and materials get expensive. So if they’re looking to stay on budget, I would just basically follow the budget. Don’t start stepping out if it’s something that you can afford. Ask the contractor what it would cost to change.

That’s where customers end up spending money, making changes midway through the project.

Don:  I think we all have to get back to reality when we’re looking at the shows that are on TV. As I always tell my wife, “It’s a TV show, okay. It’s not real life, it’s a TV show.”

There is some real-life going on. It looks like they’re cutting wood, looks like they’re hanging drywall, but they’re not all doing it in three days or a week. They didn’t tear that house down and put it back together, or one of the shows where they have 40 people and 50 contractors standing outside with all the appliances, and they all run in and build the house. So, that’s not exactly how it works.

So yeah, just remember, it is TV, folks.

Jana: It’s true!

 Thank you so much, Jon and Don, for another great set of answers to our questions.

We’ll be talking to an architect soon in our series and will interview someone who can speak for the insurance companies on their side of the process. Within the next month, we’ll be ready to talk to you both about what leads up to pouring the foundation and beginning to build a house from the ground up.

I hope that you will be with us and I really look forward to talking about that.

Don: Thank you. Thank you for having us.

Jana: Thank you!

On our website, Fromdisastertodreamhome.com we have posted a 12-month timeline where you can see the process of what you will need to do month by month in order to stay ahead of your contractors when building a new home.

We’ve been speaking with Don McMaster and Jon Hill of McMaster and Hill Construction for the past two weeks about the beginning process of building a house from the ground up.

Last week, we talked about the process of working with insurance companies when the client is rebuilding after a disaster. Please check out our earlier episodes.

McMaster and Hill Construction was founded in 2017 and specializes in water and fire restoration. Over the past four years, they have grown the company into a leading full-service remodeling and design firm.

McMaster and Hill now specialize in high-end remodels, home additions, kitchen and bath remodels, and complete fire rebuilds. With over 40 years of combined experience, Don and Jon had the skillset to fit any client’s needs.

Thank you so much for joining us again.

Announcer:

Thank you for joining us on this episode of From Disaster to Dream Home, the podcast that takes you inside the home-building and rebuilding process.

Each week, we bring you time-tested practices and the latest trends through conversations with top professionals in the building industry.

You can find other episodes of From Disaster to Dream Home at ewnpodcastnetwork.com, as well as Spotify, Apple Podcast, Audible, and most other major podcast streaming services.

Need design help? You can contact us or find out more about our guests at fromdisastertodreamhome.com. Until next time. Let us guide and inspire you as you create the home of your dreams.